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"Unified" belts for secondary titles- i dont agree

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"Unified" belts for secondary titles- i dont agree

Postby DaKrow52 » 2002/08/01 Thu 12:24 pm

This debate has popped up from time to time, so I figured I'll just see what everyone here thinks. When it comes to maybe two World titles being unified, then yes, I
say either carry both belts out or create a new belt representing the
Unified championship. However, when it comes to the unification of
secondary titles, I agree with the current practice in North American
wrestling: the lesser title gets "absorbed" into the more prestigious
one and the more prestigious one sticks around in its current form.
Thats what happened when the UWF and NWA World TV titles were
unified, when the NWA National and United States titles were unified
(hey, how come no one jumped on the NWA's case for not making new
belts?;-), the WWF and WCW World Tag Titles, the WCW US and WWF
Intercontinental, and of course, the IC and the Euopean. I just think
the more prestigious belt should represent the title "as is". plus,
unified secondary titles would probably "upstage" the World Title.
Someone had a GREAT (I really loved it) idea of calling the current
Intercontinental title the WWE Triple Crown; while it sounds awesome,
its actually too good of a name for a secondary championship/ Think
about it; what sounds cooler: WWE UnDisputed Champion, or WWE Triple
Crown Champion? I dunno about you all, but I'd rather be a triple
crown winner, and that upstages the importance of the World title. Plus, I like the fact that Japan keeps all the belts and North America "absobrs" them; it gives us a cool contrast of styles and variety.
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You make...

Postby Mutoh-Mania » 2002/08/01 Thu 12:46 pm

very good points. Secondary titles should be that secondary. The only way I could see WWE using the "Triple Crown" theory would be if they had a guy win Unified, IC, and Cruiserweight Championships. Vince has shown little but contempt for cruiserweights so I doubt we ever see this version of a "Triple Crown". Although if they went by what a cruiserweight actually is...then they could put all those straps on Benoit, or Latino Heat. But I dare say we are to far down the Sports Entertainment Bricked Road to see this.
When in doubt...shoot
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You also make

Postby DaKrow52 » 2002/08/01 Thu 2:40 pm

excellent points as well. While Vince generally treats the cruiserweight division like poop (just look how far the "Light Heavyweights are gonna pick up real soon" mantra that JR repeated every Ross Report got THAT incarnation of the division); he does have on special knack when it comes to cruiserweights: He does manage to market them successfully in the Heavyweight division because he markets them as Superstars who just happen to be light, not "lightweights", if ya knoiw what I mean. Randy Savage, Ricky Steamboat, Shawn Michales, Chris Jericho, Chris Benoit, Eddie Gurrero, and even Bret Hart would all be considered cruiserweights, but since Vince pushed them as stars, no one ever perceived them as just "lightweights" the way someone would see the Hurricane or Jamie Knoble as "just cruiserweight guys who should only wrestle other cruiserweights".
Joe P.
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And with simply our two posts...

Postby Mutoh-Mania » 2002/08/01 Thu 3:10 pm

We have sadly described why there is no true Cruiserweight Division..and further why there will be no US version of the "Triple Crown".:(
When in doubt...shoot
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Postby phil » 2002/08/01 Thu 7:14 pm

Im just curious as to what titles the world, ic and tag in WWE have been unified with WCW titles but what other titles through that can they claim liniage to because of the unafication with the WCW belts.
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Postby Hisaharu Tanabe » 2002/08/01 Thu 8:17 pm

WWE "Undisputed" Title unified WCW World Heavyweight Title (no, NWA World title didn't become WCW title no matter what you believe)

WWE Tag Team Title unified WCW World Tag Team Title (which also unified JCP/Mid-Atlantic version of NWA World Tag Team Title in the 90s)

Intercontinental Title unified United States Heavyweight Title (which also unified NWA National Heavyweight Title in the 80s) and European title

That's all I know. Anybody else?
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I think you nailed it

Postby DaKrow52 » 2002/08/02 Fri 10:30 am

We can just do it in "list" format as well for eazy reference:

WWE UnDisputed World Heavyweight Championship Lineage
-WWFE World Heavyweight Title
-WCW World Heavyweight Title
(which was unified with the) -WCW International World
Heavyweight Championship (ok, ok, so the WCW International
title wasn't exactly great, but it was still a major, recognized,
and seperate title (Japan recognized it as the WCW
International Title, so it gets included here;-)

WWE Intercontinental Heavyweight Championship Lineage
-WWFE Intercontinental Title (***Pat Patterson was also the WWF North American Heavyweight Champion when he was awarded the Intercontinental Title, but the NA Title was never officially unified with the IC; in fact, there was one more WWF NA Champ before the title was abandoned in 1981- this is all from this site too;-)
-WCW United States Heavyweight Championship
-(which has direct lineage to the) NWA/JCP United States
Heavyweight Title
-(which was unified with the)- NWA/JCP National Heavyweight
Title (I think this title was originally based in Georgia, IIRC)
-WWFE European Title

WWE World Tag-Team Title Lineage
-WWFE World Tag-Team Title (and all the lineage from just the "WWF"-branch of the title
-WCW World Tag-Team Title
-(which has direct lineage to the)- NWA/JCP World Tag-Team Title

I think that's about it...anyone else?
Joe P.
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Postby Dan Poutsma » 2002/08/02 Fri 4:56 pm

The IC title can also by extension claim lineage to the old "NWA" Georgia heavyweight title, which was unified with the National title in 1981.

And yes, the National title was originally recognized by NWA member Georgia Championship Wrestling, Inc. After Vince McMahon bought controlling interest in the company in July 1984 (and briefly billed the Spoiler as the WWF National champion), the title was resurrected by Ole Anderson and Fred Ward's Championship Wrestling from Georgia outfit, which was taken over by Jim Crockett Promotions, Inc. in early 1985.
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Postby BENJII » 2002/08/09 Fri 12:50 pm

By looking at the list of unified titles and how they've evolved, it seems to me this new Euro-Continental title is more prestigous than the Undisputed title when it comes to it's heritage
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Postby Hisaharu Tanabe » 2002/08/09 Fri 4:16 pm

...and when it comes to who have held the title recently. IC title matches have been a lot more enjoyable for years. :D
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Postby screwloose » 2002/08/09 Fri 4:32 pm

i have to agree. what's more entertaining, rvd vs. eddy guererro or undertaker vs. jeff hardy?
"uh, you're a tool?" rvd to big show after show wanted to know why he didn't get the ic title shot
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Postby BENJII » 2002/08/09 Fri 6:11 pm

I believe on the Wrestlemania 2000 DVD, Jericho makes a comment about the IC Title. I paraphrase here -

I always wanted to hold the Intercontinental title more than the World Title. The IC title has held a lot more prestiege and is a lot more dear to my heart


He has a point. Look at who's held the Intercontinental title - HBK, Bret Hart, Mr Perfect, Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho, The Rock, Steve Austin, Rob Van Dam, Triple H, Ultimate Warrior, etc.

Point is all of these people have been, or are, firm favourites within the wrestling fan base and all have done spectacular things within their careers. I agree with Chris' statement
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Postby edgehead1984 » 2004/06/16 Wed 3:36 pm

didn't the NWA National title also absorb the NWA Georgia title as well???
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Postby Dan Poutsma » 2004/06/18 Fri 12:46 pm

<!--QuoteBegin-edgehead1984+--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (edgehead1984)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->didn't the NWA National title also absorb the NWA Georgia title as well???[/quote]

Yes, I mentioned it in one of the previous posts. Both of those titles were under the auspices of Georgia Championship Wrestling, Inc. The National title that was unfied with the U.S. title was under the auspices of Jim Crockett Promotions, Inc. and had been ever since it took over Championship Wrestling from Georgia in early 1985. CWG "continued" the National titles after Vince bought GCW, Inc. in 1984.
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Postby Haiku Warrior » 2004/06/18 Fri 3:15 pm

<!--QuoteBegin-BENJII+--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (BENJII)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Look at who's held the Intercontinental title - HBK, Bret Hart, Mr Perfect, Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho, The Rock, Steve Austin, Rob Van Dam, Triple H, Ultimate Warrior, etc.[/quote]

All of these guys (except for Perfect [well AWA] & RVD) have one the world title though. I understand that the I-C is a prestigous title. For Jericho to say he would rather hold a secondary title than the major title in the major promotion in the world sounds suspect. Maybe it was because Y2J hadn't won the "big one" yet when he made that commment. I-C champions are great but it is always a stepping stone for the World title. I-C title may have been the pinnacle of some wrestler's careers but every wrestler should strive to become the "best in the world" and become the Heavyweight Champion.

BTW- Everyone forgot about the unification match of the IC and Harcore titles between RVD & Tommy Dreamer.
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